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Originally posted by eroller:
[QBErnie - who personally feels "Genesis" carries too many passengers for my own enjoyment...[/QB]

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Wasn't Project Genesis the mater reorganization device on Star Trak II - Wrath of Khan. .

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Oh yes, it was. "Project Genesis" represented a threat to the entire galaxy : it could generate life on a dead planet but could as well wipe out entirely already existing ecosystem (yeah, I'm a trekky...). I don't know if RCI choose this name partly in reference to the movie. If it's the case, I don't really know what this actually means.
Perhaps, it indicates that this ships can be a major step in RCI struggle to match Carnival Corp, or on the contrary a financial desastre if they can't fill it properly.

In ST III : The Search for Spock, we see that "Project Genesis" was indeed a failure : it acted too fast and eventualy blown up the planet where the device was used. Let's hope RCI won't eplode all the same due to Genesis commercial failure.

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Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:

Ernie, I bet you are one of the first to cruise on her, though.

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I don't know. It depends on how innovative the ship really is. To be honest I'm really turned off by the massive amounts of people. Unless there are major advancements to reduce the lines and waiting onboard (buffets, Purser's Office, getting on/off the ship, etc.) it's really unappealing to me.

I applaud RCI for being so bold, but the amount of people on my last VOYAGER OF THE SEAS cruise was about the max for me.

I also have the major concern that the pool area will not be large enough for all the people. I'm a "sun person" and love the pool, but if it's packed 24/7 and you can never get a lounge chair then there is no appeal (no matter how innovative the area is).

Certainly I would like to see the ship, but maybe a "visit" will be enough to satisfy rather than an entire cruise??

I guess I'm getting older and my tastes are changing.

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Originally posted by eroller:
I don't know. It depends on how innovative the ship really is.

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Like you Ernie, I'm lucky enough to have cr cruised on the QM2 and a Voyager Class. I can't imagine any ship being much more innovative than they both were at the time.

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure FOS and Genesis will be great, but I think that many of the big innovations have already happened.

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Originally posted by Pascal:

[...] I don't know if RCI choose this name partly in reference to the movie (Star Trek). [...]

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This would be utmost ridiculouse - with all respect to those who are interested in Star Trek, but the Genesis is the first book of the bible - and this was a bit earlier than Star Trek.

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Joe1690 wrote:
I am confused about the beam being 154 ft considering the voyager class has a beam of 156-157.5 depending on the vessel and the freedom has a beam of 184.

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The beam measurement for Project Genesis should be that of the moulded breadth, not distance between bridge-wing tips. A ship of this length has to have a wider hull. Is that logical?

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However if it does lend any guidence to what MIGHT happen I think maybe a few things are planned.

The aft part of the ship looks like it may have open deck space, either for laying out, or maybe for special features.

They seem to have a space on the fan tail for the beach pool concept you can see on Akers website. That makes sense given that the pool deck will simply not accommodate the percentage of 5,400 that actually use it. That might help the pool issue somebody noted.

Some alarm was made at the lack of a promenade. Looking at the lifeboats, I don't see any way of boarding them unless they add one.

Some concern was noted about the lack of big glass windows related to the Voyager class dinning room. I do see large window space aft of the lifeboats, and hinted at inside the two blue stripes on decks below of it. I noted before that I think traditional dinning isn't a wise option for this ship. If I had to guess, I'd purpose that we see a return to separate dinning rooms like that on the Sovereign class. Elegant, unique, and easier to diffuse the sense you are in a room with 2,600 other people. Maybe they'll rotate dinning rooms depending on the day, or have you book yourself into each on a daily basis. Regardless, I have to think a different approach will be taken on this ship.

They seem to have added a battery of hot-tubs along the pool deck.

If my zoom features works, I'm curious if I'm not seeing a trace of trampolines where the mini golf and basketball court is.

They Viking Crown Lounge seems to be fully two decks.

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Stevie2020 wrote:
How do you think Carnival will rival to this. Looks like Carnival is being left behind the competition. There will be 3 Freedom series ships plus Project Genesis.

RCCL will have no competition in the "Biggest Ship" game.

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and...

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BigUFan wrote:
That's probably where Project Pinnacle comes in.

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As far as I know Fincantieri have never publicly stated the size of Project Pinnacle and maybe for good reason. Others have released news snippets that she was going to be in the range of 180-200,000gt.

Now that RCI has confirmed it is going to build a 220,000gt cruise ship, I think we shouldn't be too surprised if Carnival ups the ante, even if it is only by 5,000gt. Having the biggest cruise ship in the world is good publicity.

The issue, I think, is whether Carnival decides it is economically feasible to have one or two of these (monsters) or rather a larger fleet of (say) 100-150,00gt ships that can be deployed worldwide.

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Originally posted by Atlcruiser:
I read somewhere today that the QM2 is 237 feet tall and this ship is going to be 240 feet tall. Not much taller than the QM2 if those figures are correct.

Gordon

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Originally posted by bulbousbow:

As far as I know Fincantieri have never publicly stated the size of Project Pinnacle and maybe for good reason. Others have released news snippets that she was going to be in the range of 180-200,000gt.

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Something else about "Pinnacle" that will most likely be dramatically different than "Genesis". Carnival has said all along that Pinnacle will be "revolutionary" and not "evolutionary". RCI's Genesis project is clearly "evolutionary" as she basically looks like an enlarged version of FREEDOM OF THE SEAS and certainly has typical "ship" attributes.

I truly think Project Pinnacle will look more like an aircraft carrier, with a huge flat deck on top and some accommodation towers that sprout from it. Most of us have seen such "concept ships" on various shipyard websites, and I think that is more of what Carnival is getting at. I think when Pinnacle finally does get the go-ahead, it will look like nothing we have seen before (and nothing will come close in expense either).

Meanwhile Carnival is a decade behind RCI when it comes to pure hardware innovation, yet they remain the most profitable and popular cruise line in the world. Go figure. It just goes to show you that not everyone is interested in the latest trends and innovation. Some people just prefer the solid basics, which is why companies like Wal-Mart and McDonalds remain extremely popular brands. Perceived value at a low cost.

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Originally posted by lasuvidaboy:

Of course most won't want to be poolside at the same time, but that is a hell of a passenger load.

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Oh I think they will. Genesis will most likely be slated for the 7-day milk run from Miami to the Caribbean. These are the most popular cruises for "fun in the sun". I think the majority of passengers will want to be out on deck during late morning and early afternoon, and no doubt it's going to be packed well beyond capacity. It's a real turn-off for me but maybe there are some outdoor decks we can't see from the rendering?

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Originally posted by Patsy:
Course, theoretically, bigger ships should mean less on the seas and stop the overcrowding. But we know that will never happen.

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That would work if the total number of cruisers stays the same, but more people are going all the time, so instead of a fleet of small ships, we now have big fleets of huge ships, which are still sold out.

"If you build it, they will come." (And I remember the "experts" scratching their heads back in 1981, wondering how in the world Carnival would find enough people to fill the TROPICALE, in addition to the other ships in the fleet!)

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Originally posted by Patsy:
Course, theoretically, bigger ships should mean less on the seas and stop the overcrowding. But we know that will never happen.

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Carnival Conquest 110,000grt -- 2,974 double berths!!

RCI Genesis 220,000grt -- 5,400 double berths.

Seems RCI has the advantage, twice the size, but less than double the passengers.

In my opinion, comparison of passenger space ratio with QM2 is pointless, two different markets and demographics. The only valid comparison between QM2 and any other major mass market ship is the "Biggest Ship in the World" award to hang on the wall. After that it's apples to oranges.

I agree though, some major innovations and squeezing every bit of deck space will be a necessity. But two points to remember, (1)on a typcial RCI 7day itin there are only 2 sea days, and(2)their ships have so many other features and options, many people do not lounge on deck by the pool. These are very activity driven ships, I'm sure RCI will continue to break new ground inside the ship where many passengers will spend time at sea(including ice skating, studio B, royal promenade, etc).

[ 02-08-2006: Message edited by: Darrell ]

[ 02-08-2006: Message edited by: Darrell ]

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Originally posted by Darrell:
Carnival Glory 110,000grt -- 2,974 double berths!!
RCI Genesis 220,000grt -- 5,400 double berths.

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But how much of those tonnages is usable deck/walking space. No doubt Genesis will have a huge inside prom. Unless you can fly it's of no use. One could build a 300,000gt vessel in the shape of a sphere with 3 decks. Oodles of gt but pax crammed into a tiny area. I would like to see how many sq feet each pax has in public deck space. It would be a more meaningful figure.

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Originally posted by Darrell:
A lot of people are commenting/complaining about the number of passengers/ space-to-pax ratio... but take a look at what the other cruise lines current stats are:

Carnival Conquest 110,000grt -- 2,974 double berths!!

RCI Genesis 220,000grt -- 5,400 double berths.

Seems RCI has the advantage, twice the size, but less than double the passengers.

In my opinion, comparison of passenger space ratio with QM2 is pointless, two different markets and demographics. The only valid comparison between QM2 and any other major mass market ship is the "Biggest Ship in the World" award to hang on the wall. After that it's apples to oranges.
[ 02-08-2006: Message edited by: Darrell ]

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Remember that GRT is a measurement of total internal capacity of a vessel, not the actual physical size. We have already determined that the new RCI ship will be the approximate size of the QM2 and not much bigger than Freedom, but with a WHOLE LOT more people.

Genesis 1180' ft long, QM2 1132' (48' longer than QM2)
Genesis 154' ft wide QM2 135' (19' wider than QM2)
Genesis 240' tall, QM2 236 (2' taller than QM2)
Genesis 6400 passengers, QM2 3090 passengers (3310 more passengers than QM2)

Genesis 1180' x 154' w/6400 passengers
Conquest 952' x 116' w/3800 passengers

What would be the usable space ratio per passenger of the comparisons?

[ 02-08-2006: Message edited by: dmwnc1 ]

I cruised on Explorer and QM2 within a week of each other in in 'August' 2006. The QM2 felt so uncrowded, compared to Explorer that had people everywhere. One was never alone!