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quote:Originally posted by Fairsky:Studying the design reveals a few key changes from the Princess version.1. The funnels (duh)2. MUTS seems better integrated in front of the funnel3. The balcony decks are blended into the fore and aft superstructures.4. The lifeboats on RP are inboard but on the P&O ship they clearly hang outside the hull. Notice the shadows. And they are a different design. This may mean a different promenade design or obstructed cabins. 5. No seawalk on the P&O ship.
1. The funnels (duh)2. MUTS seems better integrated in front of the funnel3. The balcony decks are blended into the fore and aft superstructures.4. The lifeboats on RP are inboard but on the P&O ship they clearly hang outside the hull. Notice the shadows. And they are a different design. This may mean a different promenade design or obstructed cabins. 5. No seawalk on the P&O ship.
I have a feeling the lifeboats and davit design will be the same on both ships. Remember these drawings are somewhat preliminary (especially the Princess one) and I also believe the P&O drawing has more detail.
Ernie
One main problem I can see is that this ship with Princess does not have a glass sliding roof over the pool. I am not sure if the P&O ship will get one, but P&O ships tend to go to climates where you may need this feature. P&O go to the Baltic, Norway, Iceland etc. Princess does not tend to go there as much as P&O.
I feel for the climate that P&O travel to a glass roof is imperative on their ships.
you may be right, and i think it would be odd for these ships to have different lifeboat arrangements, but take a look at this image from Princess. It shows the RP lifeboats in detail and they appear to be recessed over the hull.
whereas the image of the P&O ship shows very clearly a shadow on the hull indicated the lifeboats are outside similar to Nor. Epic.
granted, these images are preliminary and not from the same angle...but with renderings now CG and based on the ship's actual architecture (unlike renderings of the past done by artists)...it would be odd to have such a significant detail not be accurate.
quote:Originally posted by Fairsky:eroller,you may be right, and i think it would be odd for these ships to have different lifeboat arrangements, but take a look at this image from Princess. It shows the RP lifeboats in detail and they appear to be recessed over the hull.
While anything is possible, I highly doubt the finished product will result in two different lifeboat arrangements. There would be no reason to do so. The entire purpose of building a multi-platform ship is to have as many elements uniform as possible. This decreases the overall cost and provides easier cross-utlization of crew if desired. It would be more feasible if the Princess ship was already built and it was decided after a test period that a different arrangement was desired.
I'm guessing the renderings just are not that detailed, or it's also possible that Carnival Shipbuilding decided on a different arrangement for both ships after the Princess rendering was released. So perhaps it's updated on the P&O version but they never bothered to update the Princess rendering. It's certainly not a detail most people would care about or even take notice of. Just a possibility.
quote:Originally posted by Fairsky:I agree with your logic, Ernie. I think you're very likely right. But it would be rather curious if they were different. And if CCL went through the effort/expense of changing the lifeboats and promenade arrangement...why not other structural elements as well. Well, in a few years we'll know the answer.
You know I decided to watch the Princess video of ROYAL PRINCESS again. It does show the lifeboat arrangement in a lot more detail. Of course as you pointed out on RP the lifeboats sort of sit on the promenade deck (like the Solstice Class), where as on the P&O ship they hang off the side like OASIS and EPIC. Also on the Princess version the promenade deck in front of the first lifeboat is a large open deck. On the P&O version it appears all enclosed.
So maybe they will be different? It makes no sense to me but perhaps there is some internal arrangement change that required a different lifeboat arrangement? P&O did change the funnel and took off the skywalk, so perhaps they changed the lifeboat arrangement too in order to incorporate more internal space?
We should know for sure when the deck plans are released. Thanks for pointing it out. You obviously have a good eye for detail.
P&O have just modified her making her an adults only ship which would mean she would have limited use downunder where the adults-only market is still concentrated with premium lines.
[ 06-02-2011: Message edited by: reeves35 ]
As said above the refit makes Oriana less marketable to many lines. In any event when Oriana does leave P&O and probably comes to Australia it will probably have to have a refit where cabins are smashed out in order to get the kids club back.
One other thing I forgot to mention. Now P&O are getting a clone of Princess and as P&O are favoured by me more than Princess, it is giving me little incentive to try the ship with Princess knowing that I can easily sail on it with P&O if I wanted to.
Does anyone else feel the same way that these cruise lines are shooting themself in the foot sharing clones as there is little incentive to try other lines based on new and innovative ships.
What is the lenght of the new ship ?
quote:Originally posted by eroller:While anything is possible, I highly doubt the finished product will result in two different lifeboat arrangements. There would be no reason to do so. The entire purpose of building a multi-platform ship is to have as many elements uniform as possible. This decreases the overall cost and provides easier cross-utlization of crew if desired. It would be more feasible if the Princess ship was already built and it was decided after a test period that a different arrangement was desired.[....]I'm guessing the renderings just are not that detailed, or it's also possible that Carnival Shipbuilding decided on a different arrangement for both ships after the Princess rendering was released.
Whereas I agree that since we have not yet seen the actual ships we do not know whether e.g. changes were made to the Princess design (compared to the first press releases) but I don't think that there 'must not' be 'more substantial' differences between two varieties of 'one platform'. Modern design as well as production methods make it comparably easy to 'customize' or change a design in a rather significant way while still maintaining (cost saving) commonalities.
quote:Originally posted by Sutho:One other thing I forgot to mention. Now P&O are getting a clone of Princess and as P&O are favoured by me more than Princess, it is giving me little incentive to try the ship with Princess knowing that I can easily sail on it with P&O if I wanted to. .
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I'm just the opposite. I prefer Princess and there is little incentive for me to try the same ship sailing for P&O.
It's been a gripe of mine ever since Carnival started cloning ships across multiple brands. I understand all the reasons behind it, but as savvy consumer who knows cruise ships and cruises often I'm drawn to companies that don't support this practice. I don't mind cloned ships within the same brand, it's when they are across multiple brands I begin to have issues. Thankfully it's been Royal Caribbean's practice to design unique ships for the Royal Caribbean and Celebrity brands and that is one reason I'm drawn to these two cruise lines.
This new platform from Carnival Corp has the potential to find it's way across six different brands. Whether that happens or not I don't know, but I do know I would have little interest in sailng the same ship across six different brands.
As with the Princess newbuilds I like this ship. Im not too crazy about the two seperate funnels however those are the only minor issues I have. Can't wait to see more of this ship.
Also, when Carnival orders their new ship(s) i'm pretty sure its going to be this hull. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't.
Cam J
quote:Originally posted by eroller:I'm just the opposite. I prefer Princess and there is little incentive for me to try the same ship sailing for P&O. It's been a gripe of mine ever since Carnival started cloning ships across multiple brands. I understand all the reasons behind it, but as savvy consumer who knows cruise ships and cruises often I'm drawn to companies that don't support this practice. I don't mind cloned ships within the same brand, it's when they are across multiple brands I begin to have issues. Thankfully it's been Royal Caribbean's practice to design unique ships for the Royal Caribbean and Celebrity brands and that is one reason I'm drawn to these two cruise lines. This new platform from Carnival Corp has the potential to find it's way across six different brands. Whether that happens or not I don't know, but I do know I would have little interest in sailng the same ship across six different brands. Ernie
That is one of the reasons I booked Celebrity Solstice for March 2013 out of Sydney. Unique ship with a cruise line I am yet to try.
I could have tried HAL or Cunard as my taste of Premium but there was little incentive as they both use Vista ships and I have already tried a Vista ship with P&O.
In general my mood towards Carnival is changing to not liking them at all and I am slowly feeling like defecting to competition lines. Reasons are pricing - knocking back prices close to sailing punishing those who book early, running substandard shabby ships out of Australia - poor/little choice for us. Onboard prices have shot up in the last few years with P&O is making me lose interest in continuing with them.
RCI and Carnival will always have a fundamental difference in how they deploy their hull types and that is because they have a fundamentally different brand strategy. RCI have a strategy of using a couple of brands around the world. This has strengths and weaknesses. For example RCI is a great product but most Australians would not think of Royal Caribbean when looking for a South Pacific cruise.
Carnival have a multi-brand strategy so they naturally have to spread hull types across their brands. It would be lunacy if they created a unique hull for Costa and another for Carnival and another for Princess. Carnival have adopted a soft-product differentiation strategy and generally it works but there have been some notable failures.
Brad
Princess and Carnival have over done it with the Grand / Destiny classes, so my hope is to see 2-4 of this class across 3 or 4 brands. This should open the opportunity for more designs (I hope).
Let's face it, ships are expensive to design and build, and all the lines RCI, NCL, and Carnival are going to get the most bang for the buck. Also, while we tend to judge, 98% of the traveling public go because they like the service or the intinary, not because of the ship. I must admit, I am not a big fan of the Grand class, but I am going on my 9th cruise on one because I enjoy Princess and where they are going.
This ship could be a good new design if its space ratio is more friendly than the enlarged Grand class.
For a ship enthusiast like myself different ships are important as much as the cruise.
I find it amusing that some groups of people dont know the name of the ship they are sailing on. I wonder how they get on in land holidays when they dont know the chain of hotel they are staying at or the name of the airport to go to or which countries they are visiting. To me people that dont know all the above are living in pixieland with their head in the clouds.
quote:Originally posted by Sutho:Does anyone know what the specifications are of Royal Princess like length, width etc.
I dont beleive those specifications have been released yet.
Ken
P&O (like Cunard) has some great historic names to choose from but as w/Cunard, they apparently don't want to re-use them. The current line-up of P&O names sound a little like Matson Lines names.
They have little history themselves to go back on in name choosing !
quote:Originally posted by eroller:I'm just the opposite. I prefer Princess and there is little incentive for me to try the same ship sailing for P&O. Ernie
I'm just the opposite. I prefer Princess and there is little incentive for me to try the same ship sailing for P&O. Ernie
Ive cruised with Princess in Australian waters and Im trying the Diamond for new years eve this year. Would you mind sharing what the main differences are? I quite like the Princess ships and would consider the P&O UK ships. Though one would think I should expect a very similar product
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