Its future is still uncertain, but the SS United States is getting a below-the-deck makeover to make it more appealing for developers interested in turning what was once the world's fastest ocean liner into a massive dockside attraction.

Workers began a project in October to remove tanks and other materials from the belly of the ship to make way for modern utilities systems that would need to go in to transform it. There's a second objective to the project, which is expected to last well into 2014: selling the materials to raise the $50,000 to $60,000 it takes each month to maintain and insure the vessel.

The SS United States Conservancy, the nonprofit group that owns the ship, warns that if its grand plans do not come together quickly, there might be no choice but to sell the historic liner as scrap.

"It's a great fixer-upper," said Susan Gibbs, executive director of the SS United States Conservancy and the granddaughter of William Francis Gibbs, the ship's Philadelphia-born designer, on a tour of the ship.

The ship was built by Newport News Shipbuilding and launched in 1952 as the world's fastest ocean liner. After it went out of service, it was docked for many years in Norfolk.

How to use the ship - as long as three football fields and a monument to shimmery aluminum and the sleek lines of mid-20th-century Modernism - has been a conundrum for more than 40 years.

The SS United States still holds the record for speediest trans-Atlantic voyage. The ship was partially funded by the Navy with the idea that it could be converted one day into an extremely efficient troop transporter.

But it was never called into service by the government. And by 1969, after carrying four presidents, Prince Rainier of Monaco, Elizabeth Taylor and a million other people across the Atlantic, it was retired from its regular duties.

The hulking ship has been berthed on the Delaware River in Philadelphia since 1996, its once-bold red, white and blue paint faded and its iron oxidizing in a pier across the street from a shopping center.

Over the years, plans to make the SS United States into a cruise ship have failed, partly because it was designed for speed, not slow-moving recreation, and is narrower than modern cruise ships.

The conservancy used a $5.8 million gift from a Philadelphia philanthropist in 2010 to buy the ship. The group's vision is different from others that came before. It wants to turn it into a multi-use attraction, perhaps with restaurants, a hotel and banquet facilities, along with a maritime-history museum.

Some retired naval ships - including the New Jersey in nearby Camden and the Intrepid in New York - have been turned into museums. But the high overhead costs of keeping a boat afloat, even if it's stationary, can bring financial difficulties. Despite fundraising efforts, the ship's owners would have a difficult time paying basic bills without selling some scrap.

There is at least one model for the sort of development the SS United States owners have in mind. The SS Rotterdam opened three years ago with a hotel, museum and school in its namesake city in the Netherlands. [i// forgot to mention the Queen Mary in Rotterdam[/i]

Thomas Basile, a consultant with the conservancy, believes it would be feasible in New York City or Philadelphia.

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Originally posted by BMWM5:
The longer she sits where she is, the less likely anything will happen.

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I think she's already passed the stage where anything will happen.

Scrapping and painting the ship is a major undertaking. It's not a simple as slapping some paint on her. There are significant environmental issues in the removal of the paint and trying to use volunteers would be an insurance nightmare. It all needs to be done at a shipyard or other professional facility in a controlled environment.

As for the ship being about ready to sink that is simply a totally misinformed statement. Several very knowledgeable professional marine engineers have looked her over and said she is in remarkably good condition. The hull shows minimal signs of wastage, no leaking and even the aluminum superstructure is in remarkably good condition considering everything is now over 60 years old. Structurally I would venture to say she is in better shape than the Queen Mary.

Moving the United States to an alternate pier is a very difficult undertaking for a number of reasons. Of course she would need tugs and even then there are major logistical considerations. In the local area there are very few available berths that can accommodate a ship of her size. It was looked into and the decision was that she is best off where she is.

Internally she is in overall good condition and professional caretakers have kept her stable on the interior for a very long time. The Conservancy is using professionals to undertake the harvesting of scrap materials from the lower areas. It is not something a group of volunteers could handle. The material being removed has to be handled very carefully and everything has been first surveyed to ensure that they are not taking anything that is historically significant and needed for potential future displays. What is being removed is scrap that would have to come out at some point to make way for modern systems in a commercial re-use.

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Originally posted by SSTRAVELER:
Well let's set the record straight.

Scrapping and painting the ship is a major undertaking. It's not a simple as slapping some paint on her. There are significant environmental issues in the removal of the paint and trying to use volunteers would be an insurance nightmare. It all needs to be done at a shipyard or other professional facility in a controlled environment.

The best thing the volunteers can do is offer their moral and financial support to the Conservancy and they work to spread the word to find potential partners to work with the Conservancy to make the dream of re-use a reality.

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Here here, I boarded her back in April for a tour. All of the rust and rot is surface. Inside she is strong and clean. Her hull is very overstructured with anti-racking bulkheads everywhere.

Her vast expanses of camber, shear, and tumblehome require the expertise of a dwindling number of shipwrights who are still alive.

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Originally posted by desirod7:
Here here, I boarded her back in April for a tour. All of the rust and rot is surface.

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So as Neil said "she looks like a rust bucket which could at any time sink" - first impressions count and I doubt any investor will look further than the outside, then walk away, regardless of how many reports there are indicating how structurally sound she actually is. People don't stay in hotels that look in a terrible state from the outside, are in a not particularly nice looking area ie docks, or go shopping in a run down looking mall if there is a nice sparkling one across the road - regardless of what any unseen interiors may be.

Time ticks on and on...... and on... while money flows in to a black hole. If there is any hope at all the outside appearance is surely priority, of her and the surrounding area.

( Cherry pickers are a hydraulic operated safe working platform which can be moved around on a long arm. )

Electric operated scrappers, with a vacumn type attachment, are available in the UK which solve the problems of containing the removed paint !

As Pam has said appearences make a lot of difference !

With the present exterior appearence of the ' United States ' I doubt if they will ever get the required investment to save the ship.

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[ 12-06-2013: Message edited by: Neil - Ex P. & O. S. N. Company. ]

The environmental concerns and insurance would not permit it. The ship needs to be in a controlled environment to work on her. The environmental rules since she is in the water would require a "containment" environment to be built. (That is where you put up plastic shearing or such Neil). And nothing can enter the water since the old marine paint is all considered to be an environmental issue.

Also you underestimate the total height of the ship from the dock. You could not reach into the upper works, superstructure, funnels, etc. with a lift.

Also she is in an active slipway so it would be difficult if not impossible to paint the side away from the dock. Painting the port side and leaving the starboard side raw would look more slip shot.

Also the cost of painting the ship is not insignificant. You want to write a multi-million dollar check for the paint, rental of the lifts, constructing the containment environment, getting the necessary permits, hiring at least supervisors if not a full crew, etc. etc. etc.? If you have a big enough bank account the Conservancy would love to hear from you.

To do it correctly the ship will need to be sandblasted (that's the way all ships are properly painted) and then coated and painted. These type of paint jobs are done in a dry dock because then the paint scraps fall to the floor and can be properly contained/remediated at the end of the process.

The appearance of the ship has not been a issue with any professional developer. The challenge is this a specialized project because you need a developer, a pier, long-term docking privileges, etc. to make it work.

As I said the professional marine engineers and architects who have toured the ship (as well as David went on the spring as part of a special group) have been very impressed by her physical condition. The rust is surface rust. The hull is extremely sound (NCL also confirmed this when they did surveys) and the caretakers have been doing a good job of maintaining the interiors and dealing with with any significant issues.

It would be nice to see people instead of criticizing the Conservancy using their energies to help support the efforts by talking up the potential and offering up even small dollar financial support.

How many people here are a plank owner?

The explanation about cherry pickers was for those who may not know what they are !

Rest assured big cherry pickers are available which could reach all of one side of the ship from a jetty.

We recently had one on hire which could extend out 35 meters and reach a height of 61 metres !

I did not suggest that the paint job she requires needed to be a strip the hull job but a quick paint job to improve her appearence and end her looking like an old abandoned rust bucket .

At present, with her outside looking terrible I doubt if anyone would consider investing in any activity on her !

Her only real chance of being saved was if ownership passed to a large American company, like Disney, who have the finances required to turn her into an American maritime museum with some other attractions on board.

As she is an American ship the money to preserve her should be raised in the USA but it seems that there is not a lot of interest in her from American citizens !

It also seems the conservancy have wasted a lot of money since February 2011, when they assumed ownership of the ship, with nothing being done to make this ship a tourist attraction or attract financial support !

I would not be supprised if before long she is taken to a ship breaking yard !
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[ 12-07-2013: Message edited by: Neil - Ex P. & O. S. N. Company. ]

https://www.savetheunitedstates.org/ !

[ 12-08-2013: Message edited by: SSTRAVELER ]

This is a project for saving a US built ship and keeping her in the USA.

Here in the UK we already have a selection of British built saved classic ships so why should we be expected to helping in saving a ship in America which is a very rich country !

Our preserved classic ships include the 1953 built ex royal yacht ' Britannia ', which is now a maritime museum, and the 1948 built sea going paddle steamer ' Waverley ' which is in full operational condition and cruises around the coast of the UK.

You should raise the money yourselfs if the US public want the ' United States ' saved.

At present it looks as if this will not happen due to the lack of interest in her !

Did you donate to help save any of our UK classic ships ?

I have !

What I have never quite understood about the SS US is why there seem to be so many preserved warships in the US but relatively few passenger ships? Is it just that they are not that well known on this side of the Atlantic?

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Originally posted by Michael534:
And this countries collection of saved ships include a 80,000 ton ocean liner that was British built and owned. Your welcome!

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Michael534

Its the Arabs and the Chinese who are saying that other British boat .....

I don't see any ocean liners preserved in England. Do you?

Maybe its time we put a bill in the mail?

As for why war ships and not ocean liners? A guess is they make better tourist attractions and also get more political support. I don't believe the US Navy is helping with the expenses of the retired ships but they have helped with the initial clean up. I did hear that the aircraft carrier Intrepid is one of the most popular tourist attractions in New York City.

As for what the US Conservancy has done and not done I can not speak fully to that -- I am only an observer -- but I know they did develop plans and protocols plus they have had discussions with several possible partners. Some or all did not pan out for various reasons but the explorations are on going. They have also achieved a lot of press coverage on their efforts and they have had talks with a lot of other entities to make possible the long-term effort. For example they not only need a developer they also need to secure a location and I know they have met with various entities that would be involved in securing a future local. For example in New York City there are literally dozens of parties that would be involved if the ship is to fine a home there. I know they have had successful talks with a number of these entities to gain their support for a possible berth and similar explorations have taken place in other locations.

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Originally posted by SSTRAVELER:
So where the British buyers for either of the Queens? It was two American entities that put up the money for each of the Queens. And if it were not for Americans the Queen Mary would be razor blades or at the bottom of Hong Kong harbor like her running mate.

Its the Arabs and the Chinese who are saying that other British boat .....

I don't see any ocean liners preserved in England. Do you?

Maybe its time we put a bill in the mail?

As for why war ships and not ocean liners? A guess is they make better tourist attractions and also get more political support. I don't believe the US Navy is helping with the expenses of the retired ships but they have helped with the initial clean up. I did hear that the aircraft carrier Intrepid is one of the most popular tourist attractions in New York City.

As for what the US Conservancy has done and not done I can not speak fully to that -- I am only an observer -- but I know they did develop plans and protocols plus they have had discussions with several possible partners. Some or all did not pan out for various reasons but the explorations are on going. They have also achieved a lot of press coverage on their efforts and they have had talks with a lot of other entities to make possible the long-term effort. For example they not only need a developer they also need to secure a location and I know they have met with various entities that would be involved in securing a future local. For example in New York City there are literally dozens of parties that would be involved if the ship is to fine a home there. I know they have had successful talks with a number of these entities to gain their support for a possible berth and similar explorations have taken place in other locations.

This is a herculean task for a non-profit and that's why they really do need everyone's support if they are going to have anyyy chance to making this work.

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quote:

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Originally posted by SSTRAVELER:
So where the British buyers for either of the Queens? It was two American entities that put up the money for each of the Queens. And if it were not for Americans the Queen Mary would be razor blades or at the bottom of Hong Kong harbor like her running mate.

Its the Arabs and the Chinese who are saying that other British boat .....

I don't see any ocean liners preserved in England. Do you?

Maybe its time we put a bill in the mail?

As for why war ships and not ocean liners? A guess is they make better tourist attractions and also get more political support. I don't believe the US Navy is helping with the expenses of the retired ships but they have helped with the initial clean up. I did hear that the aircraft carrier Intrepid is one of the most popular tourist attractions in New York City.

As for what the US Conservancy has done and not done I can not speak fully to that -- I am only an observer -- but I know they did develop plans and protocols plus they have had discussions with several possible partners. Some or all did not pan out for various reasons but the explorations are on going. They have also achieved a lot of press coverage on their efforts and they have had talks with a lot of other entities to make possible the long-term effort. For example they not only need a developer they also need to secure a location and I know they have met with various entities that would be involved in securing a future local. For example in New York City there are literally dozens of parties that would be involved if the ship is to fine a home there. I know they have had successful talks with a number of these entities to gain their support for a possible berth and similar explorations have taken place in other locations.

This is a herculean task for a non-profit and that's why they really do need everyone's support if they are going to have anyyy chance to making this work.

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SS TRAVELER

Always remember that the Queen Mary was bought to be operated as a business just as it was intended to return the Queen Elizabeth to service !

UK investors are more carefull !

In the UK we have preserved the smaller 1843 built passenger ship ' Great Britain ' which when built was the largest passenger ship in the world !

There has been a lot of support for this ship which has enabled her interior to be completely rebuilt and her iron hull protected in a dehumidification chamber to prevent corrision !

The Cutty Sark is the most well known and took 6 years and £50m to refurbish after the fire. Funds coming from many sources, public and private. That's what SS US needs....

Hotel ships are expensive to maintain and do not tend to be very successful. People are not fighting to visit maritime museums.

The Queen Mary's challenges have been well documented starting with the fact that she was worn out and lacking maintenance when she arrived in Long Beach. Remember the funnels were so rusted away that they said only the paint was holding them up. She needed an entirely new electrical system as well. She was put in an out of the way location which has nothing around it to attract people to the area. The hotel operation on board has at times been more successful than others in large part due to the quality of the management.

Britain's lack of a liner on its shores is not for lack of trying. A group tried first to save the Windsor Castle for a hotel in the Docklands. They failed. They tried to save the Amerikanis for the same purpose. They failed. There was a lot of talk about trying to bring the QE2 back to English shores ... she is leaving for Asia.

As I said the US Conservancy should be commended (and supported) for taking on a herculean task that no one else was serious about trying. They were successful in gaining control of the ship and a small dedicated group is working hard to try and overcome very difficult odds to achieve something that has only been successfully done on a few occasions.

Instead of criticizing them for what they have done wrong and the fact that the ship is not sparkling and modern everyone needs to give them credit for what they have done.

And as I said some support would really be helpful:

How many people here are a plank owner?