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»	Cruise Talk » Ocean Liners and Classic Cruise Ships » name the ships , very hard one (Page 1)

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Topic: name the ships , very hard one

Cunardcoll
First Class Passenger
Member # 1226

posted 03-30-2004 08:07 AM

Can anyone name the ships in these photos from Southampton ??

Jochen

Larger Version Larger Version in context

Larger Version

[ 03-30-2004: Message edited by: joe at travelpage ]

Posts: 947 | From: Belgium | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged

CGT
First Class Passenger
Member # 3531

posted 03-30-2004 09:19 AM

Look at the larger version in context and look at the two funneled ship way off deep in the backround.

Posts: 2760 | From: New York, New York, USA | Registered: Dec 2002 | IP: Logged

Johan
First Class Passenger
Member # 4458

posted 03-30-2004 10:25 AM

Hi
The second Mauretania far off
and the Majestic ? or Berengaria ?

Posts: 1895 | From: Antwerpen, Belgium | Registered: Feb 2004 | IP: Logged

sslewis
First Class Passenger
Member # 3649

posted 03-30-2004 11:50 AM

It is Southampton.
But what is the Flying boat doing there?
The two funneled ship is rmsQueen Elizabeth.
The second liner, 3 funneled, was Tirpitz, but changed names a few times.
The one in the foreground is a combination liner..
Hope it helps, let me see my library..

Posts: 2513 | From: Shipspotting Solent shores when weather allows.... | Registered: Feb 2003 | IP: Logged

Cunardcoll
First Class Passenger
Member # 1226

posted 03-30-2004 01:10 PM

The flyingboats were normal sights in those days , they had a regular flyingboat service back then.

Jochen

Posts: 947 | From: Belgium | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged

mec1
First Class Passenger
Member # 4287

posted 03-30-2004 02:39 PM

I think it is Accra or Apapa then Mauretania - no idea what the third ship back is but it is Queen Elizabeth over at the Cunard berth.

Mike

xxx

Posts: 1675 | From: London, England | Registered: Nov 2003 | IP: Logged

Malcolm @ cruisepage
Cruise Director
Member # 301

posted 03-30-2004 03:22 PM

One of them is definately not a ship!

Posts: 19210 | From: Essex (Just Outside London) | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

linerguy
First Class Passenger
Member # 4289

posted 03-30-2004 05:12 PM

I'm narrowing this down a bit. The time frame is between Feb. '38 and Sep. '39.

This makes it impossible for the ship in the background to be Queen Elizabeth.....actually, I think we're looking at two different ships back there.

This also makes it impossible for the 2nd ship to be Mauretania.....she was gone by '38. My guess is that it's a Canadian Pacific "Empress" ships.

The ship in the bottom photo, I think is Empress of Britian or Japan.

Russ

[ 03-30-2004: Message edited by: linerguy ]

Posts: 1486 | From: Bright, Indiana | Registered: Dec 2003 | IP: Logged

Michael534
First Class Passenger
Member # 2953

posted 03-30-2004 06:56 PM

Hmmmm..... This IS a hard one.

First off, I am almost possitive that sslewis is correct about the second ship being the Empress of Australia/Tirpitz. The masts are exactly the same, as is the placement of the four air intakes around the second/middle funnel. The next two ships in the pic are going to have to wait until after dinner. As far as the first ship goes. I am amost sure she is a Union Castle liner. Though the pic is B and W, you can see she has a darker hull and a darker stripe on top. The second word on the bow looks like it could be "Castle". The first word looks like the last tow letters are "c" "k". ?

Off to search, search, search!
Laundry will have to wait until tomorrow

Later,
Michael534

Posts: 483 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Apr 2002 | IP: Logged

Michael534
First Class Passenger
Member # 2953

posted 03-30-2004 08:36 PM

Ok. A guess at the third ship...

Is it either the Windsor or Arundel Castle?

Not much of the ship is showing, but from what there is to work with (decks, window placement and count, bridge wing) it does match the sisters.

I think you've got a lot of people stumped here!

Great fun, though

Michael534

Posts: 483 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Apr 2002 | IP: Logged

Aussie1
First Class Passenger
Member # 25

posted 03-30-2004 09:43 PM

The first vessel appears to be a Union Castle cargo ship. She looks similar to the ROCHESTER CASTLE of Malta convoy fame. (One of the 4 cargo ships of the vital Pedistal convoy that made it to the island along with the tanker OHIO.)

Posts: 493 | From: Sydney,NSW, Australia | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

Grahame
First Class Passenger
Member # 2325

posted 03-31-2004 12:51 AM

I think the front liner is the Durban Castle,followed by the Mauretania waiting to be towed to the scrapyard and therfore berthed at the new docks,and the liner in the distance at the ocean terminal I think is the Majestic...I agree that in the second photograph it has to be the Empress of Australia,her funnells are not big enough for the Empress of Britain....I have no idea what is docked behind the Mauretania,but I suspect it would be another union castle liner.

Posts: 34 | From: Australia | Registered: Aug 2001 | IP: Logged

Grahame
First Class Passenger
Member # 2325

posted 03-31-2004 01:07 AM

On looking at the union castle liner in the front of the photograph again I think it has got to be either the Warwick or Winchester Castle which were in operation in 1935,because the Mauretania left for the scarpyards in july of 1935.Which would rule out the Durban Castle opf the late thirties.A great photo quiz.

Posts: 34 | From: Australia | Registered: Aug 2001 | IP: Logged

linerguy
First Class Passenger
Member # 4289

posted 03-31-2004 02:47 AM

The clue that it is NOT Mauretania is that one of the flyingboats in the photo, Corio, entered service in Feb. 38. In Sept. 39, Corio had her markings changed to G-AEUH and Calypso was changed to A18-11-

There is no way it is Mauretania....the aft superstructure is all wrong and her stern docking bridge is not elevated.....

Russ

Posts: 1486 | From: Bright, Indiana | Registered: Dec 2003 | IP: Logged

Cunardcoll
First Class Passenger
Member # 1226

posted 03-31-2004 05:39 AM

I don't know it either but I think the second ship in de first photo is the Aquitania in white livery , the first ship is without any doubt a Union castle liner

The ship in the second photo is one of the Empresses

Jochen

Posts: 947 | From: Belgium | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged

Johan
First Class Passenger
Member # 4458

posted 03-31-2004 07:04 AM

There is some decoration at the stern of the second ship, which I think was not usual on an original british shp, so I think it must be a (former) German liner. The ship seems rather big.

The ship in the background : which part of the port is that ? The funnels are modern looking, more Queen Elizabeth than Queen Mary style (QE is impossible). Could it be a foreign liner : Nieuw Amsterdam, or Bremen or Rex,...?

Posts: 1895 | From: Antwerpen, Belgium | Registered: Feb 2004 | IP: Logged

sslewis
First Class Passenger
Member # 3649

posted 03-31-2004 08:27 AM

Jochen,
what I mean by the Flying boats is that they actually had a dedicated berth next to Cunard.
Here, they are next to King GeorgeV drydock.
The first ship is very modern for 1938..
The large 2 funnel ship must be a Cunarder because of the stripes, may be Mauretania39?
Hang on, the flying boats are together, so it is something special, and the registration number rings a bell....

Posts: 2513 | From: Shipspotting Solent shores when weather allows.... | Registered: Feb 2003 | IP: Logged

Grahame
First Class Passenger
Member # 2325

posted 03-31-2004 08:38 AM

Congratulations on identifying the time frame for the flying boats>I have never seen a shot of them near the end of the new docks before.Therefore I agree with ss lewis that it has to be the Empress of Australia.and I am pretty sure the large liner in the ocean dock is the Berengaria,in her last days in late 1937 early 38.I dont think its the new Mauretania as she only completetd two or three voyages prior to the war,and one was from liverpool and second from tilbury.The second picture ,I think has to be the Empress of Japan,which then became the Empress of Scotland.

Posts: 34 | From: Australia | Registered: Aug 2001 | IP: Logged

Brian_O
First Class Passenger
Member # 3910

posted 03-31-2004 05:27 PM

Did not the CP ships sail out of Liverpool rather than Southampton?

Brian

Posts: 2698 | From: Pointe-Claire, QC Canada | Registered: Jun 2003 | IP: Logged

Commodore
First Class Passenger
Member # 1575

posted 03-31-2004 08:06 PM

Is the first ship Balmoral (spelling error) Castle?

Posts: 1106 | From: New Jersey | Registered: Sep 2000 | IP: Logged

Grahame
First Class Passenger
Member # 2325

posted 03-31-2004 08:58 PM

I think the Uion Castle liner at the front of the picture,after having looked at all my reference material is the 10,002 ton Dunbar Castle which hit a mine in 1940 and sank.She was used in the late 30s on the round africa service from southampton.
Re the CP liners,they scheduled a number of sailings from Southampton to Canada by the Empress of Australia and Japan owing to the fact that the Empress of Britain made Southampton its terminal port during the thirties.They moved completly to Liverpool after the war.

Posts: 34 | From: Australia | Registered: Aug 2001 | IP: Logged

Michael534
First Class Passenger
Member # 2953

posted 03-31-2004 10:03 PM

I have been comparing photos of the Empress of Australia ex Tirpitz to the second ship and am now convinced she is the same ship. Everything matches perfectly. She also sailed S'ton to Quebec until 1939. She was converted to trooping a year later.

As for the Union Castle ship. Look at the front of her superstructure...it doesn't have the large rectangle windows seen on most of the mail ships of the line. It also looks like it is curved to me. Another interesting thing is that her bridge has a bow in it. Not a common charateristic of the bigger Castle liners.

This is too fun!

Pizza's here!

Michael534

Posts: 483 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Apr 2002 | IP: Logged

Aussie1
First Class Passenger
Member # 25

posted 04-01-2004 01:34 AM

I still believe that the first vessel is a Union Castle cargo vessel. The reasons are the resemblance to the Rochester Castle type ships, the small number of lifeboats (Critical for passenger ships.), and the lack of portholes in much of the hull. (Critical for passenger ships pre air conditioning.)

Steve

Posts: 493 | From: Sydney,NSW, Australia | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 04-01-2004 06:13 AM

Well Cunardcoll you certainly know how to keep me quiet! I have spent the best part of my online time during the last two days scrutinising every photo of an 'xx Castle' ship I can find. None match exactly, though a couple are near, and some I cannot find pictures of. It is definitely 'castle' but the first word is really not readable, I keep thinking some of the letters are one thing, and then another on a relook.
Someone must know the right answer? Or send the photos to the Echo, I am sure they could clarify all the ships.
Where did you get the picture from?
Pam

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

Brian_O
First Class Passenger
Member # 3910

posted 04-07-2004 11:54 PM

Ok! It has been more than a week. Are we going to get the answers?

Brian

Posts: 2698 | From: Pointe-Claire, QC Canada | Registered: Jun 2003 | IP: Logged

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