Carnival Magic is due from Fincantieri in 2011 and will be 130,000 tons with 3,600 passengers (the same size as the new Princess orders). It's possible that the new Princess ships could be based on the almost 20 year old Destiny-class hull design. Heaven forbid!

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Originally posted by Fairsky:
We don't know yet if the new ships will be enlarged Grand-Class designs or an entirely new hull. My guess, given CCL's track record, is that they will be Grand-Class derivatives. However, there could be an even worse possibility...

Carnival Magic is due from Fincantieri in 2011 and will be 130,000 tons with 3,600 passengers (the same size as the new Princess orders). It's possible that the new Princess ships could be based on the almost 20 year old Destiny-class hull design. Heaven forbid!

Let's hope that CCL is finally investing in a truly new design.

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Micky and Alan Bucklew have stated on many occasions that these new ships will be an evolution of the Ruby Princess.

They will be slightly larger, evolved versions of the last ship in the Grand-Class.

Don't expect anything ground-breaking.

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Originally posted by Tim in 'Lauderdale:

Micky and Alan Bucklew have stated on many occasions that these new ships will be an evolution of the Ruby Princess.

They will be slightly larger, evolved versions of the last ship in the Grand-Class.

Don't expect anything ground-breaking.

Tim

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Exactly.

How they can squeeze anymore revenue out of this design is beyond me, but if there is a way Carnival will figure it out.

I just wonder how it will look. The Grand Class design is already pretty butchered, after many years of Carnival "refinements".

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Originally posted by eroller:

Exactly.

How they can squeeze anymore revenue out of this design is beyond me, but if there is a way Carnival will figure it out.

Ernie

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Pay toilets!................................price goes up during norovirus outbreaks

[ 02-17-2010: Message edited by: desirod7 ]

Probably a couple of extra restaurants, spa cabins etc.

A shame. And likely one of the lowest space per pax ratio ? But highest $ per pax.

When the Voyager-class turned into the Freedom-class there was an increase of roughly 15k tons (1 passenger deck and 92 feet of length). This new Princess ship will be a larger increase of 23k tons over the current Diamond/Ruby-class. If they are stretched proportionately (add 100 feet of length and enlarged another deck) it still makes them slightly smaller than the original Voyager-class yet still carrying 200+ fewer passengers.

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Originally posted by dmwnc1:
What is then the coveted 'space ratio' comparison between the original Voyager of the Seas and the new Princess ship?

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Originally posted by dmwnc1:
OK, here's another question. If we are comparing two ships and the space ratio difference being '3' what is that three mean? Say between 39 and 42?

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The numbers in themselves don't mean a lot, it's really used for comparison purposes. Divide the gross tonnage of a ship by the basis-two pax load, and it gives you the amount of cubic square feet per person (one GRT is equal to 100 cubic feet.)

But many ships' designs are different, so these figures can be misleading; RCI's ships have huge atriums, and vast, soaring dining rooms filled with empty, open space that gets counted in the tonnage but is really unusable space. A more exact reference would be to somehow quantify the floor space (like in a house), and that would give you a better sense of space per person. But I don't know if those kinds of numbers are ever calculated with ships; certainly never used for these purposes.

"Since these are prototypes," he said, "we hope that in the years to come they will be followed by a substantial number of ships of the same 'family.'"

What does that mean? A totally new design, or could a lengthened Grand-class also be considered a new hull and therefore a "prototype"?

BTW, space ratio really isn't as helpful as it used to be. Since ships started incorporating large open spaces (atriums, dinning rooms, etc.) it doesn't give you an accurate sense of congestion. Layout, flow, and space management is far more important.

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Originally posted by dmwnc1:
So a 3-4 cubic foot per person difference between the new Princess ship, Freedom OTS, MSC Slendida, Celebrity Solstice, and the Oasis of the Seas would be meaningless then? I am curious to why people keep referring then to the 'space ratio' component to justify a ship being crowded or not especially when so many are with 3-4 units difference?

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Exactly--space ratios become somewhat meaningless because the ship designs are not on a level playing field. RCI ships seem more spacious, but lots of that "extra" space per person is open atrium and dining room space, not really useable. "Useable" per person space, such as surface area, is not calculated.

[ 02-18-2010: Message edited by: Globaliser ]

I wonder whether it might be more realistic if the space ratio was simply calculated on the basis of the ship volume that is used by passengers. To take an extreme example, an enclosed bridge wing adds to the GRT compared to an open bridge wing, but it does nothing whatsoever for the passenger experience. So if only passenger space was used in the calculation, that might be more realistic.

Of course, that comes with the complexity of defining and measuring the passenger space, so maybe it would be more hassle and cost than it's worth for the relatively slim marketing benefits. It seems that few passengers actually use the space ratio as any real guide.

[ 02-19-2010: Message edited by: Globaliser ]

Hmm...these two new ships will be joint second biggest he has built! How long before he exceeds 150,000 gt? Any bets?

QHow many grand class ships are their at present?

[ 02-18-2010: Message edited by: Malcolm @ cruisepage ]

Grand
Star
Golden

Diamond
Sapphire

Caribbean
Crown
Emerald
Ruby

Ventura
Azura

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Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:
"In an interview with BBC Radio 2’s Jeremy Vine at The Travel Convention in Barcelona —Micky Arison said: “Queen Mary 2 (150,000 tons) is probably the biggest ship we will ever build. Carnival Dream at 130,000 tons is probably as large as we will build for Carnival. We built a ship of 116,000 tons (Ventura) for P&O Cruises and I have no intention of going bigger. I think at these sizes, we can deliver the right level of service and value.”"

Hmm...these two new ships will be joint second biggest he has built! How long before he exceeds 150,000 gt? Any bets?

QHow many grand class ships are their at present?

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Originally posted by Fairsky:
Grand Class:

Grand
Star
Golden

Diamond
Sapphire

Caribbean
Crown
Emerald
Ruby

Ventura
Azura

11 total (plus the 2 Newbuilds just ordered)

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Originally posted by Ernst:
Do Diamond Princess and Sapphire Princess really count as 'Grand Class'? Of course, strictly speaking the Fincantieri built ships are not all sister ships either (but certainly very similar and from the same 'series').

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Good point. There are slight external design differences.