Cruise Talk: Swan Hellenic still for sale

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»	Cruise Talk » Cruise Lines » Swan Hellenic still for sale

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Topic: Swan Hellenic still for sale

lebelty
First Class Passenger
Member # 3855

posted 09-21-2006 03:59 PM

While listening to Carnival Corps Q3 earnings conference call, the question was posted about Swan Hellenic. Carnivals response was that the line is still for sale and is still looking for a buyer.

tyler

Posts: 672 | From: CT/Maine | Registered: May 2003 | IP: Logged

Pascal
First Class Passenger
Member # 5510

posted 09-21-2006 04:02 PM

A line with no ships... Let's say the buyer would only acquire the name. Perhaps a good destination for Mona Lisa/Kungsholm ?

Posts: 1371 | From: Aix en Provence | Registered: Mar 2005 | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 09-21-2006 04:28 PM

A buyer for what.. there is nothing, the name is meaningless now. Sell a cruiseline with no ship... LOLOL.... Goodwill? I doubt it with the way things have been brought to an end.

Pam

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

Malcolm @ cruisepage
Cruise Director
Member # 301

posted 09-21-2006 06:20 PM

What happened to there ship?

Posts: 19210 | From: Essex (Just Outside London) | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 09-21-2006 06:26 PM

She's been 'stolen' by Princess; well will be in April

with no replacement going to SH... dead end line.

Pam

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

Pascal
First Class Passenger
Member # 5510

posted 09-21-2006 06:31 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:
What happened to there ship?

Their ship will be the new Royal Princess, Malcolm.

Posts: 1371 | From: Aix en Provence | Registered: Mar 2005 | IP: Logged

Globaliser
First Class Passenger
Member # 4153

posted 09-22-2006 06:55 AM

quote:
Originally posted by PamM:
Goodwill? I doubt it with the way things have been brought to an end.

I think this might be a bit pessimistic. Swan Hellenic had a pretty loyal following, as I understand it. And its product has USPs. If someone were able to take it up, offer the same product and keep those USPs, it shouldn't take too much to get the original crowd back again.

Posts: 1869 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2003 | IP: Logged

gaz hants
First Class Passenger
Member # 5749

posted 09-22-2006 01:00 PM

which is what saga are doing with spirit of adventure
direct comparisons in their adverts with SH
also their 2007 itins read virtually like SH even down to july/august being spend in n europe

Posts: 273 | From: hythe southampton uk | Registered: Jun 2005 | IP: Logged

Patsy
First Class Passenger
Member # 5611

posted 09-22-2006 01:08 PM

It's very sad. Pam's right. A line with no ship. It's not very viable. Wonder if the price is the same?

Posts: 2023 | From: Hythe, Hants | Registered: Apr 2005 | IP: Logged

oslo dutch
First Class Passenger
Member # 4669

posted 09-22-2006 01:21 PM

Carnival basicly took the ship from SH to Princess as it will make far much more money for them as SH would do.

So as usual it's back to revenue revenue revenue revenue........ Thanks Carnival for taking over P&O we all expected SH wouldn't last long

SH is too niche for them. Shame really, I heard great stories from Minerva 2 and would have loved to sail on her

Posts: 349 | From: Oslo | Registered: Apr 2004 | IP: Logged

goodclicks
First Class Passenger
Member # 6216

posted 09-22-2006 01:23 PM

Would Carnival actually be willing to sell to a major competior such as RCI?

Posts: 70 | From: Scotland | Registered: Feb 2006 | IP: Logged

Ernst
First Class Passenger
Member # 5369

posted 09-22-2006 02:17 PM

What is actually the asset of a line without a ship? I guess it's the brand name, the adresses of frequent customers etc. - but how important is that for a competing cruise line? They have their own staff and can hire people from Swan Hellenic (without buing the whole company) - they can also advertise without these adresses etc. - so how much worth is all that?

Posts: 9746 | From: Eindhoven | Registered: Jan 2005 | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 09-22-2006 02:56 PM

I doubt SH's mailing list is of any interest to other companies anyway. I expect every single one of her past pax is already on SAGA's SOA list and all the other non-Carnival connected UK lines too.

Pam

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

Globaliser
First Class Passenger
Member # 4153

posted 09-23-2006 08:39 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Ernst:
What is actually the asset of a line without a ship?

For Swan Hellenic, it's the brand. I think people who chose to cruise with Swan Hellenic chose it for its particular product, which the brand stood for very clearly. That, after all, is what a brand is about - it tells you, before you open the brochure, what the broad parameters are going to be of what you are getting. If another company wants to take over the brand, it would have to be with a view to continuing Swan Hellenic's particular product and USPs. Then it would have value.

Otherwise, you're right. If you are just going offer any old trip on a ship, then the brand is pretty much worthless.

Posts: 1869 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2003 | IP: Logged

FloridaKeith
First Class Passenger
Member # 6818

posted 10-19-2006 12:26 PM

UK friends of ours who have previously cruised on SH but have never had any dealings with Saga were recently sent the brochure on Spirit of Adventure and the letter introducing it specifically said they were getting it as past guests of SH. This must surely mean that Saga have bought the SH past guest list.

Posts: 19 | From: Gulf Coast, Florida | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged

cruisemole
First Class Passenger
Member # 2459

posted 10-21-2006 05:14 PM

Why is it assumed that Princess would make more money with the ship?

The running costs are 95% the same, and while Princess onboard revenue may be higher im sure Swan Hellenics brochure prices can be set higher.

Posts: 343 | From: dear ol'blighty | Registered: Sep 2001 | IP: Logged

Ernst
First Class Passenger
Member # 5369

posted 10-21-2006 05:32 PM

I would not be so sure about the running costs being the same. Anoyone who can give us an idea what the difference might be?

Posts: 9746 | From: Eindhoven | Registered: Jan 2005 | IP: Logged

Tim in Fort Lauderdale
First Class Passenger
Member # 953

posted 10-22-2006 12:17 AM

quote:
Originally posted by cruisemole:
Why is it assumed that Princess would make more money with the ship?
The running costs are 95% the same, and while Princess onboard revenue may be higher im sure Swan Hellenics brochure prices can be set higher.

There's a vast differential in the operational costs as Princess will actually own, manage and run the ship, taking advantage of Princess' scaled operational costs vs Swan, who contracts out management of a sole ship.

The biggest difference is that Princess can sell this ship out at a small fraction of the marketing costs, which when combined with higher per diems and yields (Swan was discounting heavily) and higher onboard spend (alcohol, casino, art, shore-ex), this ship will make money instead of losing money.

Tim

Posts: 1468 | From: Fort Lauderdale, FL | Registered: Dec 1999 | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 10-22-2006 03:18 AM

Tim, Carnival stated that SH *was* making money. The only discounting I have ever seen is during these last few months; they are even marketing to the US [at cheaper rates than on offer here], but presumably because it is also where Minerva II happens to be sailing.

The operating costs on a vessel doing a milk round are going to be far cheaper than one which does different voyages all the time. The line would be in a better position for bargaining terms regarding provisioning, fuel, and all the other regular expenses, pilotage, docking, shorex and so on. Perhaps also able to obtain more favouable agreements with the airlines, when regular airlift is required, rather than one offs.

Pam

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

cruisemole
First Class Passenger
Member # 2459

posted 10-22-2006 10:45 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Tim in 'Lauderdale:
There's a vast differential in the operational costs as Princess will actually own, manage and run the ship, taking advantage of Princess' scaled operational costs vs Swan, who contracts out management of a sole ship.

So why not let some suitable part of the Carnival Empire operate the ship? The Swan-Hellenic-specific portion of the operational costs is quite minor.

quote:
The biggest difference is that Princess can sell this ship out at a small fraction of the marketing costs, which when combined with higher per diems and yields (Swan was discounting heavily) and higher onboard spend (alcohol, casino, art, shore-ex), this ship will make money instead of losing money.
Tim

Fair enough, in the short term.

[ 10-22-2006: Message edited by: cruisemole ]

Posts: 343 | From: dear ol'blighty | Registered: Sep 2001 | IP: Logged

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