quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Burke: Which ships are regarded as 'Vista' class ships? Other than Arcadia I'm not familiar with any others.

---

The Vista Class was derived from Carnival's Spirit Class. Other Vista's include:
ZUIDERDAM
OOSTERDAM
NOORDAM
WESTERDAM

Enhanced Vista's include:
QUEEN VICTORIA
EURODAM
ARCADIA

Arcadia

Queen Vic

Carnival Spirit

[ 08-17-2007: Message edited by: joe at travelpage ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Burke:
Obviously QM2 is much bigger. )

---

Tom, the Queen Vic is a Vista, NOT the Queen Mary 2. The QM2 is a uniquely designed 'Ocean Liner' and is around 60k gt bigger than the Queen Vic.

I believe that all the Vista's cruise ships are all around 90k gt.

[ 08-17-2007: Message edited by: Malcolm @ cruisepage ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Burke: Many thanks, Ernie. What's the nature of the enhancements in the three you mention? Obviously QM2 is much bigger. How does Arcadia, say, differ from standard Vistas? (apologies for the questions, but I don't think I've even seen any other Vista let alone been on one.)

---

The "enhancements", if you could call them that are relatively minor. All the ships I mentioned share the same basic layout with QUEEN VICTORIA being the most different. It's the decor that sets them apart, with the HAL Vistas having a very different decor than ARCADIA and QV. ARCADIA was originally going to be QV so they added a restaurant up top (for the Grill Class) and of course that turned into a specialty restaurant with ARCADIA. EURODAM and the new QV will keep this area and expand upon it.

QV has the most dramatic changes, with the general arrangement being quite different than previous Vista's, and the outside elevators removed. At the end of the day though, she is clearly a Vista but enhanced and altered to suit Cunard.

quote:

---

Tom, the Queen Vic is a Vista, NOT the Queen Mary 2. The QM2 is a uniquely designed 'Ocean Liner' and is around 60k gt bigger than the Queen Vic.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Carlos Fernandez: I really don't think that Vista-class is derived form the Spirit-class or vice-versa, there are many differences, in layout design and everything else. Both classes are Pana-max, but that's about all they share, just basic dimensions.

---

I disagree. The Spirit Class came first, and basically Carnival designers tweaked this class of ship for HAL until they came up with the Vista Class. It's not like they started with a blank piece of paper for the Vista design. They used what they had and made the design changes to fit a premium brand. These ships are too much alike not to see the similarities and I have sailed them both. Personally I much prefer the Spirit Class. Better overall design and layout.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Carlos Fernandez:
I really don't think that Vista-class is derived form the Spirit-class or vice-versa, there are many differences, in layout design and everything else.

---

The differences (I also have sailed both) are noticeable but they are obviously 2 versions of what is basically the same thing.

Spirit has these things that Vista doesn't
Atrium (9 decks)
Extra public room below theatre
Space forward of the theatre (kids club area)

Vista has these things that Spirit doesn't
Seaview lifts midships
Crows nest location bar
Wrap around promenade deck
Much smaller atrium (3 decks ) - almost unnoticed as you walk past.

Vistas have open decks at the front of the superstructure, Spirit doesn't

Enhanced vistas have a bit extra superstructure up top, infront of the funnel, at the top of the midships elevators. They also seem to have a raise public viewing type deck on the bow - although as no ship has yet entered service we can't be sure this is accessible yet.

But broadly speaking these are very very similar ships designs. I could be slightly wrong on the above differences but those are what I remember.

By my calculation, given that these are effectively the same type of ship, this must surely be the most successful class of ship ever built (in terms of numbers)?
Spirits
4 Carnival
2 Costa

Vistas
4 Holland America
1 P&O
1 Cunard

+ 2 more on order for Costa
+ 2 more (from Eurodam) on order for Holland America. That makes 16 - so far.....

[ 08-17-2007: Message edited by: Matts ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Burke: Wow - thanks to everyone for the information. As far as I can see they're all podded. Have there been any ongoing problems with the pods? I've cruised with Celebrity so I'm familiar (from Celebrity forums) with the angst the Millenium-class ships have experienced with their pods.

---

All the Vista/Spirit Class ships have "Azipods", where as the M-Class ships with Celebrity have Mermaid Pods (like QM2 but a smaller, older version). While there have been some problems with the Azipods, they are minor compared to what Celebrity has experienced with the M-Class ships.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Matts:

That makes 16 - so far.....

[ 08-17-2007: Message edited by: Matts ]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Matts:

By my calculation, given that these are effectively the same type of ship, this must surely be the most successful class of ship ever built (in terms of numbers)?

---

Carnival Cruise Lines = 9
DESTINY class - 3
CONQUEST class - 5
+ CARNIVAL SPLENDOUR
(Can we also consider the MAGIC/DREAM in here?)

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karsten:
So... are COSTA ATLANTICA and MEDITERRANEA vista class ships? Or are they not?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Matts:

+ 2 more on order for Costa
+ 2 more (from Eurodam) on order for Holland America. That makes 16 - so far.....

[ 08-17-2007: Message edited by: Matts ]

---

The Vista and Spirit superstructures looks externally similar but are actually quite different structurally speaking. There are of course similarities in the general arrangement but no more than if you compare those vessels with any other modern large cruise ship.

What I also find interesting is that the Vista is supposed to be a premium version of the Spirit Class. Frankly I found the Spirit Class the better of the two. It felt more spacious, had a better flow, seemed much larger, and had far superior outer decks (and an additional outdoor pool). In addition, standard cabin sizes are the same between the classes.

CARNIVAL SPIRIT has a space ratio of 41.7
EURODAM has a space ratio of 40.8

Now which one is more "premium"?

I don't quite get it.

We come back to that word "perception", and that is the only reason the Vista Class comes across as superior. In reality, the Spirit Class is the better ship.

Ernie

[ 08-18-2007: Message edited by: eroller ]